NitrogenSports 10k confiscation (Case Closed)

[oligibbons]

Why do you speak for Oli each time?

I am sure you know enough to understand that they very likely think your "partner" is really you or working as part of a syndicate.

You are not helping and making him look worse.

BTW, Oliver replied that he did not wish to participate in the mediation process any further as he said he has done all that can be done already. I asked that he please continue and he stopped replying.

@BMR Disputes ,
Thank you for trying to help. Although there has been a change in your narrative that is at odds with BMR’s mission statement. As per your home page:
Our Promise to You

At Bookmakers Review (BMR), our mission is to deliver players
accurate information on trusted sportsbooks. BMR is not a website that
will recommend sportsbooks that are known for cheating players out of
their winnings or slow-paying come withdrawal time… bettors can
submit a sportsbook complaint form to lodge a formal grievance against
an online sportsbook.

You said:

“Oliver replied that he did not wish to participate in the mediation
process any further”.

This is incorrect, as I have never said that or ever alluded to that. I have acknowledged publicly that on my own I am unlikely to have any success getting the money that I won fairly. This is why I have solicited your help - which I would still be grateful for. You are welcome to share any of our correspondence, should you disagree with that.

When you emailed me, you said Nitro management was trying to reach out to me. It appears they mislead you, and I waited very patiently for them to make contact. On June 23, Nitro again told me that they were keeping my winnings. You wrote on June 24, suggesting a manager would reach out to us. This didn’t happen. When I wrote them again, they replied today that as per their previous decision, they were keeping my winnings.



Are Elihu and I acquainted, and do we share information? Absolutely, yes. I don't see the relevance of this, as long as we are following their posted rules? I also don't understand why you are altering the narrative to make this aspect a pejorative or something to be ashamed of. Elihu and I are like every sports bettor out there, we are just trying to win (anyone that says otherwise is crazy). Again, I am disappointed the narrative has been turned towards a victim blaming approach. Make no mistake, I am the victim. I placed bets that could have won or lost, and had they lost, Nitrogen would have happily kept my money and not heard a peep from me. These were not fixed matches and nor was I betting steam or arbitrage opportunities. I just had had a different opinion albeit backed up by data.

Nitro stole my money - no ifs, no buts.

Nitro has never challenged the facts – that they stole 10k from me from an unpublished rule that they selectively enforce. BMR is still recommending Nitro with a B+ rating. This seems to go against your initial promise.

@rolandcorts @Danny7 @BMR Genie feel free to chime in.

 

[BMR Genie]

BMR Dispute will check in to answer your post @oligibbons

 

[BMR Disputes Matt]

I have done my best for you Oliver.

In our last discussion I explained that our contact at Nitro wished to speak to you directly before they went further into the matter.

You came back with a rude remark that I did not understand and you have already done this.

My last message to you said this is our contact and I cannot just say no he cannot speak to you first so can you please try.

And you ignored that message and I have heard no more from you since.


Instead of asking Elihu to come on here and speak for you and damaging the chances of mediation, try communicating with me with your email and leaving him out of the problem.

I am happy to continue the process but this is about you and you partner. not BMR or our ratings.

 

[Ace7550]

Either way, it sounds like Oliver deserves to be paid. The rule Nitrogen is siting is BS.
I have a lot of friends that like to bet sports too. We talk a lot and often give each other tips. That doesn't make us a syndicate. And I don't think Elihu backing up his friend makes them a syndicate either.
Good luck Oliver.

 

[rolandcorts]

I imagine for a random bettor, even a sharp one, the likelihood of them confiscating funds is low. I don't know why they choose to do it when they do it. I had an issue with them 2 yrs ago where they thought I was similar to some other account but it was easily cleared up and resolved.

I wonder if it's truly random or maybe bettors such as Oliver are doing something that 'annoys' them. They have some vulnerabilities in how they set their lines sometimes. I don't want to say much more than that.

I think I said before in this thread I don't use them for MLB so I make sure to keep my balance at $0. But in Sept I will re-up and try to keep my balance in a comfortable range.

 

[elihu.feustel]

If a sportsbook stiffs/slows pays 0.25k in BTC for 5 months, and the value of BTC drops from 40k to 20k in that time, what is a fair resolution if the facts support that the player was owed the whole time?
Asking for a friend.

 

[FrankDexter]

I would like to know if Nitro told BMR the exact rule that was broken?

Is it the rule that was mentioned in the 1st post or is it deeper than that?

If it was the blanket rule that was posted, then that is a huge problem for any player that plays here and I would hope BMR addresses their thoughts, warn others and downgrades accordingly, if that is the case.

 

[oligibbons]

I imagine for a random bettor, even a sharp one, the likelihood of them confiscating funds is low. I don't know why they choose to do it when they do it. I had an issue with them 2 yrs ago where they thought I was similar to some other account but it was easily cleared up and resolved.

I wonder if it's truly random or maybe bettors such as Oliver are doing something that 'annoys' them. They have some vulnerabilities in how they set their lines sometimes. I don't want to say much more than that.

I think I said before in this thread I don't use them for MLB so I make sure to keep my balance at $0. But in Sept I will re-up and try to keep my balance in a comfortable range.

I don't believe I did anything nefarious to 'annoy' Nitrogen. I asked them for my sports betting history to prove that I never bet arbitrage, steam, or fixed matches. Along with my Bitcoin they were determined to hold onto my data too, refusing to give me that.

My conjecture to what annoyed them was that I "took out more than I put in"... So I would ascertain they are unhappy with people winning. I quote:

Given that you have already taken out funds in the amount of your total deposits, plus an additional profit, we will not allow any further withdrawals and winnings will be seized.

Your account will be permanently closed due to access from restricted location, you have already taken out equivalent of all deposits plus a profit. Therefore, funds will be seized and account will be permanently closed in accordance to our site rules.

We are sorry to inform you that, as previously advised, your funds were seized and will not be returned as you violated our website rules. You have already taken out equivalent of all deposits plus a profit.

At least they informed me that they hoped each response they gave "finds me well". They pride themselves on being thoroughly polite in thievery!

You have to appreciate the little things in life!

 

[BMR Disputes Matt]

I would like to know if Nitro told BMR the exact rule that was broken?

Is it the rule that was mentioned in the 1st post or is it deeper than that?

If it was the blanket rule that was posted, then that is a huge problem for any player that plays here and I would hope BMR addresses their thoughts, warn others and downgrades accordingly, if that is the case.

No, they have not given any further explanation to BMR than they have directly to Oli. They are suggesting that he played from a banned jurisdiction but BMR have pointed out the length of time he has played, deposited and withdrawn without any form of location obfuscation as making this confiscation difficult to understand.

We are still trying to follow the mediation process and Nitrogen are so far trying to not engage in specifics with us.

Hopefully we get further but there is obviously something the book does not wish to reveal as they would usually talk to us about issues like this one.

 

[Ace7550]

If they don't reveal anything else than they need to be downgraded. Books that stiff people can't be graded B+.
Until this is resolved I won't be playing there.

 

[oligibbons]

I would like to know if Nitro told BMR the exact rule that was broken?

Is it the rule that was mentioned in the 1st post or is it deeper than that?

If it was the blanket rule that was posted, then that is a huge problem for any player that plays here and I would hope BMR addresses their thoughts, warn others and downgrades accordingly, if that is the case.

@FrankDexter here are all the responses from Nitrogen on the given rule:






The countries that I have accessed their site from include but aren't limited to:
USA
United Kingdom
France
Costa Rica
Panama
Mexico

All of which have laws and regulations that would allow them to trigger this incredibly vague rule.

 

[BMR Disputes Matt]

@FrankDexter

The countries that I have accessed their site from include but aren't limited to:
USA
United Kingdom
France
Costa Rica
Panama
Mexico

All of which have laws and regulations that would allow them to trigger this incredibly vague rule.

First time I am hearing about all these countries.

Did the UK and France usage happen close to the end or much earlier? Did you withdraw or deposit whilst in those countries?

Not saying Nitro rules justify confiscation but those are two hot jurisdictions who do try to make problems for bookmakers who flaunt their licensing rules.

 

[oligibbons]

First time I am hearing about all these countries.

Did the UK and France usage happen close to the end or much earlier? Did you withdraw or deposit whilst in those countries?

Not saying Nitro rules justify confiscation but those are two hot jurisdictions who do try to make problems for bookmakers who flaunt their licensing rules.

I am British and was born in the UK. I make trips back regularly and played there on several trips throughout the history of the account being open. I logged in when in France but never placed a wager.

I believe the majority of my deposits have been made in the US and Costa Rica. Where I spend the majority of my life.

At no point have i tried to obfuscate where I am from or located. Accessing a site as a person that travels a lot again seems very weak for confiscation of funds.

As I have mentioned before. The issue with location was only made a deal of after they identified me as a winning player, limited my wagering sizes and then refused to pay.

 

[elihu.feustel]

First time I am hearing about all these countries.

Did the UK and France usage happen close to the end or much earlier? Did you withdraw or deposit whilst in those countries?

Not saying Nitro rules justify confiscation but those are two hot jurisdictions who do try to make problems for bookmakers who flaunt their licensing rules.

Back in my day at SBR, I investigated 1000's of disputes as Justin7. The process was simple.
If everything the player says is true, should he win?
If yes, talk to the other side. What do they disagree with or add?
If there was a real factual dispute, try to figure out what the facts were. Most of the time, it was obvious when I looked at logs from both sides. Look at facts and fairness (based on US Contract law), make a recommendation.

You contacted Nitro. If they refuse to engage in discussion of facts at all without explaining why, that usually meant they were in the wrong and had no defense. If they didn't want to discuss a case for a particular reason (and this happened occasionally -- they don't want to reveal security/fraud countermeasures, or they are restricted by privacy laws), they would tell me that. We can't discuss this because of X. If they aren't telling you what X is, they are in the spot where they know they mugged a player, and they believe the silent treatment will cost them less long-term than directly addressing the dispute.

If there's a fact Nitro offered to support that seizing the winnings was correct or even arguable, please elaborate.

 

[rolandcorts]

 

[rolandcorts]

If a sportsbook stiffs/slows pays 0.25k in BTC for 5 months, and the value of BTC drops from 40k to 20k in that time, what is a fair resolution if the facts support that the player was owed the whole time?
Asking for a friend.

Dumb question. Rewrite as "If a BTC only sportsbook slow pays 0.25k in BTC ..." you get your answer.

 

[elihu.feustel]

In Nitro's response, it said "clearly Costa Rica has legislation that prohibits gambling." What law prevents a player from placing a bet? I searched for such a Costa Rican law, and could not find it.

 

[rolandcorts]

Every book has a rule somewhere that basically says they can take your balance for any reason. Their rules don't mean anything. This is a lawless industry where only reputation matters. And you went looking into costa rican law? Are you serious?

 

[Ace7550]

This is a lawless industry where only reputation matters.

Exactly. That's why they either need to pay Oliver or get demoted to the D range.
Unless they have a good reason for not paying. But I haven't seen any evidence of that yet.

 

[rolandcorts]

I honestly think Nitro just decided something rogue was going on with the account. For example they probably strongly suspected something they don't like (multi-accounting for example) and decided that was it. Then they pick any arbitrary rule to hide behind. The rule doesn't matter. Of course, this is dishonest behavior on the part of the book and unless they provide BMR with compelling evidence then they should be demoted as Ace says... but who cares about ratings anyways. Most of the best shops are not A.