Do You Believe In Predestination?

[phillyflyers]

Like I said we will never agree. Good luck.

Good luck.

Now let's get back to the topic of the thread.

Predestination.

Is it real or not?

How can it ever be disproved if not?

 

[edawg]

It can't be disproven or proven in this world. I get that it is one of the hardest things to believe because it almost makes trying to be a decent good person useless. If your saved or not from the beginning what does it all matter? Guess that is where God being more just and loving than we can ever imagine comes by faith.

 

[phillyflyers]

It can't be disproven or proven in this world. I get that it is one of the hardest things to believe because it almost makes trying to be a decent good person useless. If your saved or not from the beginning what does it all matter? Guess that is where God being more just and loving than we can ever imagine comes by faith.

Disagree.

Some cases can clearly be proven and I've already cited Joan of Arc as an example.

How does a teenage peasant girl rise to defeat the greatest army on earth?

Can you explain this logically because no one in history has been able to yet.

She said she talked to angels and they guided her.

Can this be explained?

England was seeking to conquer France and convert it to Protestantism.

God prevented it through her, she claimed.

She was predestined, clearly.

 

[Archie]

Ezekiel 23:20 pretty much explains all of this

 

[phillyflyers]

Ezekiel 23:20 pretty much explains all of this

It has nothing to do with this.

 

[edawg]

Arch is smart enough to know it is not to be taken literally he is just being a smart ass.

 

[Archie]

Ezekiel 23:20 pretty much explains all of this

there she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

 

[gauchojake]

If you think about our existence in terms of a "universe" meaning that there is only one version of our timeline, then predestination makes sense. If you think about existence in terms of an infinite number of "multiverse's" then you realize that we are just in the timeline where things like Joan of Arc happened, however unlikely. You can then reconcile free will - you have free will in this timeline and the choices you make help determine outcomes. You cannot know the outcomes since there are so many variables, but you can choose to live a life of positivity which typically makes your life a better one.

 

[phillyflyers]

there she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

What does that have to do with anything in this thread?

 

[phillyflyers]

If you think about our existence in terms of a "universe" meaning that there is only one version of our timeline, then predestination makes sense. If you think about existence in terms of an infinite number of "multiverse's" then you realize that we are just in the timeline where things like Joan of Arc happened, however unlikely. You can then reconcile free will - you have free will in this timeline and the choices you make help determine outcomes. You cannot know the outcomes since there are so many variables, but you can choose to live a life of positivity which typically makes your life a better one.

In Joan's case, she wasn't using her free will.

Instead, she followed the call from God.

It's unexplainable. Literally, her entire existence still can't be explained.

Yet it happened.

I don't believe in multiverse or any other science theory that has no evidence for it.

It's like me saying in another universe, I'm the greatest gambler that ever existed who never lost a bet.

Prove it.

Until then, it's just junk.

The fact that predestination cannot be disproven alarms me.

Because the question then becomes is this really is what is supposed to happen with no way to decide for ourselves?

That's fukkin mind boggling.

 

[maltedhopsfrenzy]

So what?

What are those other religions worth if they can't save your soul from Hell?

Worthless.

There's only one saviour for humanity and He isn't found in Buddhism or Judaism or any other religion.

Do you think it's a coincidence that Christianity produced the greatest civilization ever known to man?

That the cultures of the Catholic peoples of the world pushed man to a level never before seen?

Why is that? Ask yourself. Was that coincidence?

Or could it be that when you are rooted in truth, wonderful things happen?

You’re fake whatever is better than everyone else’s fake whatevers.
O.K. Got it. We’re done here…..

 

[phillyflyers]

You’re fake whatever is better than everyone else’s fake whatevers.
O.K. Got it. We’re done here…..

What's fake?

Jesus had 12 people around Him 24/7 plus a few stragglers who all witnessed His life and every one of them died giving their life in witness to Him.

You aren't going to die for a lie. No one is.

If you don't believe that's fine, but don't ever fukkin say Jesus was fake.

 

[phillyflyers]

Oh and by the way, yes it is better than everyone else because Christianity produced Western Civilization which is clearly the greatest ever produced by humanity.

 

[Pimike]

Ok but I don't see the Bible as the authority anyway. I see the Church as the authority.

The church? It can’t be the authority.

The Bible was written by the guidance of the Holy Spirit. It is trustworthy.

If God elected some but not others than the blood shed of Christ was in vain.

Thats why Salvation as scripture states is open to all. Only unbelief will cause you to go to Hell.



.

 

[phillyflyers]

The church? It can’t be the authority.

The Bible was written by the guidance of the Holy Spirit. It is trustworthy.

If God elected some but not others than the blood shed of Christ was in vain.

Thats why Salvation as scripture states is open to all. Only unbelievers will cause you to go to Hell.



.

Thr Church has always been the sole authority.

The Bible as we know it, didn't come into existence until the invention of the printing press almost 1600 years after Christianity and the Church was established.

The Bible has never been nor will ever be an authority. Especially when it comes to personal salvation.

There is absolutely nothing in the Bible that says it is required reading for salvation.

On top of that, what happens if one happens to be illiterate?

His salvation isn't now possible simply because he can't read?

This is why you protestants fukked everything up.

Bunch of clueless fukkin heretics.

EDIT: It was also the Catholic Church that gave the world the Bible.

 

[Pimike]

Psalm 12:6

The words of the LORD are pure words,
Like silver tried in a furnace of earth,
Purified seven times.

2 Timothy 3:16

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness

2 Peter 1:21

For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

There it is!!

 

[phillyflyers]

Psalm 12:6

The words of the LORD are pure words,
Like silver tried in a furnace of earth,
Purified seven times.

2 Timothy 3:16

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness

2 Peter 1:21

For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

There it is!!

This proves nothing. Again, when Christianity first began, the Bible didn't exist.

What don't you understand about that?

It's never been thr authority and never will be. It can't be.

 

[Pimike]

This proves nothing. Again, when Christianity first began, the Bible didn't exist.

What don't you understand about that?

It's never been thr authority and never will be. It can't be.

Lol

These words were written before 1600

King James was translated into English then.

 

[Pimike]

They translated this from Greek, Latin. Of course it was there.

Man has always had the word of God.

 

[phillyflyers]

Lol

These words were written before 1600

King James was translated into English then.

Thr Bible itself wasn't around when Christianity began.

There wasn't any Bible for anyone to read.

Who was the authority, then?

What happens if one is illiterate?

He is automatically condemned because he can't read?

How about the person who never heard of the Bible?

Their salvation is impossible?

The Church is the only authority that's ever existed. Nothing has changed. It's still the authority.